• rr808 5 hours ago

    Snopes says that in the UK 9 children died on pen lids between 1970 and 1984. Since the holes in the lids zero children choked to death. Is the 100/yr in the USA really true?

    https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/holes-pen-caps-prevent-cho...

    • 0xbadcafebee 2 hours ago

      The story says 100 people per year in the US, not specifically children, die of choking on pen lids. I can't find any source for that number. But choking is the third leading cause of death by unintentional injury (https://injuryfacts.nsc.org/all-injuries/deaths-by-demograph...). The vast majority of choking cases are from food, and largely by the elderly.

      Edit: it appears the source for the claim is Rachfeed[1], the news and entertainment blog that this Independent story comes from. Rachfeed links to a story from OMG Facts[2] which is down due to a DNS error. The Wayback Archive only has 1 record for that page, and it's unavailable. So the only source for the claim is basically nonexistent.

      A sultan-and-oligarch-owned tabloid quoting a rag quoting an unavailable source. This is a newspaper of record in the UK.

      CNET ran a similar story[3] in 2016 with the "100 deaths a year" figure, quoting The Independent as a source. Thousands of sites seem to have republished it, quoting those two as sources.

      [1] https://rachfeed.com/pen-caps-hole/ [2] http://www.omgfacts.com/health/8329/Pen-caps-cause-100-death... [3] https://www.cnet.com/tech/computing/pen-caps-have-holes-beca...

      • bigstrat2003 2 hours ago

        I'm quite surprised that this actually works (or seems to, based on the Snopes link). The holes in these pen caps are tiny, and I feel like if I had one lodged in my airway I still wouldn't be able to suck enough air through that. But I guess you can't argue with results.

        • EnigmaFlare 36 minutes ago

          You can try breathing through one to see. But the hole may also prevent it getting sucked into/deeper into your windpipe in the first place by preventing a seal.

      • yatopifo 2 hours ago

        Is lid the preferred term for a pen cap in the UK? To me, a lid is always something flat(ish). This is not a criticism, of course! Just a curious observation…

        • lkramer an hour ago

          The heads of Lego figures started having a hole in the top for the same reason I believe.

          • jamesfinlayson 30 minutes ago

            Oh, I remember seeing the occasional Lego head with a solid top when I was younger but never gave it a second thought. I want to say this changed in the early 1990s at the latest?

          • jms703 2 hours ago

            How does the whole in the cap prevent ink from drying?

            • chad_oliver 2 hours ago

              From the article: "it is not about preventing the ink drying on the nib."

            • gnabgib 7 hours ago

              "A hundred people every year in the United States reportedly choke to death on these pen lids." :|

              • somerandomqaguy 5 hours ago

                Children apparently. And common enough apparently that ISO formalized it:

                > This document specifies requirements to reduce the risk of asphyxiation from caps for writing and marking instruments. It relates to such instruments which in normal or foreseeable circumstances are likely to be used by children up to the age of 14 years.

                - ISO 11540:2021, https://www.iso.org/standard/81889.html

                • dyauspitr 2 hours ago

                  Things like this is what I think about when people talk about regulatory overreach. There are just so many details that need to be laid out for a society to function smoothly.

                • jaredwiener 6 hours ago

                  "People" can include toddlers, etc.

                  • danielheath 6 hours ago

                    Yeah, two-year-olds love to put random found objects in their mouths, often accidentally inhale them, and often lack the correct throat motions to unstick a round object.

                    • tourmalinetaco 5 hours ago

                      If memory serves, pennies are the most common object for young children to choke on, coupled by the fact that anemia makes them “tasty”. Perhaps we need to consider adding holes in coins to reduce that.

                      • AdamN 3 hours ago

                        Coins used to have holes in them more often so that they could be put onto a string for counting/storage.

                        • makeitdouble 3 hours ago

                          Holes in coins have many other advantages, including reduce material volume, potentially tactile feedback if we could have them different shapes, and so much more.

                          Would there be downsides outside of manufacturing cost and having to design with the hole in mind ?

                        • iancmceachern 5 hours ago

                          I choked on a penny when I was a kid, had to be taken to the hospital and got it out.

                          They said that most just pass though the digestive system, I was special

                          • bigstrat2003 an hour ago

                            I'm curious, if you were choking on a penny how did you even survive long enough to get to a hospital? Going without air will kill you in a matter of minutes, tops.

                          • Dalewyn 5 hours ago

                            Between most metals tasting "sweet" and the mouth being a baby's foremost sensitive way of accruing information about something, babies and small kids are instinctively driven to put anything and everything in their mouth if it fits and consider metals as food until sternly educated otherwise.

                            It takes a long time before any of the other senses become mature enough to be (more) useful avenues of accruing information and parents can finally stop worrying about it.